The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (Mr. Sadiq Khan): It is a pleasure for me, Mr. Speaker, to wind up a debate for the first time with you in the Chair, and that its subject should be local government. I was a councillor for 12 years, serving with great pride in the ward of Tooting in the London borough of Wandsworth. The hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Robert Neill), who opened the debate for the Conservatives, also has considerable experience in that regard.

When the Minister for Local Government opened the debate, he spent almost an hour talking about local government, and he rightly went into huge detail about the consequences for local authorities of the problems in Icelandic banks. The fact that we have ended our

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debate with a discussion on the means of preventing extremism demonstrates the depth and breadth of the issues that local government covers, from the free doughnuts proposed by the hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst to the pungent smell of mushrooms in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for Bassetlaw (John Mann).

I want to begin by paying tribute to the thousands of local authority employees—who do a tremendous amount of work, and who often dedicate their careers to public service through being council employees—and to the many others associated with local government. I also pay tribute to the thousands of councillors who do such a huge amount of work around the country. Many distinguished Members of Parliament are former councillors; some are about to be former councillors; and some might have become better parliamentarians had they had the experience that some of us have gained in council chambers.

I have only a few minutes in which to touch on many of the points made in the debate. I enjoyed the passion with which the hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst talked about the Icelandic bank crisis. He is a West Ham fan, and one can appreciate why he has been quite troubled over the past few days. We were not sure where his passion came from, but we gave him the benefit of the doubt and decided that it was a passion for local government.

The hon. Gentleman brought a smile to my face, as someone who served in the London borough of Wandsworth for 12 years. He will remember when, in 1991, the then Prime Minister decided to set a huge dampening grant for certain local authorities. Westminster and Wandsworth were the two beneficiaries that ended up with a zero council tax. When the hon. Gentleman referred in his speech to “screwing the system”, I, of course, knew that he had recently re-read the John Major autobiography, so he knew why some local authorities got a huge whopping dampening grant and could set such low council taxes.

I particularly enjoyed the hon. Gentleman’s analysis of local government finance and the robust approach that he took to it, as well as the detail with which he explained the issues. I have to say, however, that although he spent a lot of time—almost 30 minutes—offering a critical analysis, I do not remember any beef in terms of what his party would do if, God forbid, it were to form the next Government. That silence spoke volumes.

The hon. Gentleman spoke about the bonfire of regional bodies that have huge levers to do a huge amount of good and about the bonfire of the standards regime and accompanying regulations that ensure that councillors maintain minimum standards. He will be aware that, in the current climate, there is a debate to be had about the bonfire of regulations in the mid-80s, which some say led to today’s problems. We await with interest the evolution of Conservative policy on local government.

My hon. Friend the Member for Blyth Valley (Mr. Campbell) spent considerable time talking about his concerns about Northumberland. I know that my hon. Friend the Minister for Local Government has visited Northumberland and that he was making copious notes as my hon. Friend was speaking. I am sure that some of the points raised will be dealt with via correspondence.

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The hon. Member for Falmouth and Camborne (Julia Goldsworthy) spoke about issues ranging from the White Paper and localised business rates to the unfairness of council tax, as she sees it, but the interventions on her demonstrated how unfair we think her proposals are as an alternative. The hon. Lady talked about police authorities and revaluation, but her main concern—and rightly so—was the Icelandic bank crisis and its impact on local authorities. She wanted us to provide more detail about what sort of authorities the 16 affected were—the 13 and the other three that my hon. Friend mentioned. I cannot go into any more detail than did my hon. Friend, except to say two things. First, a joint statement has been published by the Local Government Association and the Government, which the hon. Lady can obtain at the end of the debate. Secondly, the sort of local authorities affected are wide ranging: there is no one type, as they are different councils in different parts of the country and the circumstances are different in each case.

The hon. Lady also criticised us—unfairly, I thought—for following events rather than acting in advance of them. She will be aware that we set up a rapid response team before we knew about the need to use it for local authorities and she will know that its representatives are now helping local authorities up and down the country. I also have to disagree with her analysis and agree with that of my hon. Friend the Member for Bassetlaw, who said that now is not the time for post-mortems or the blame game. That time will come, but our priority now must be to ensure that investments are safe, that jobs are secured and that local authorities are able to serve our constituents. It is not possible to have it both ways. On the one hand, we are criticised for trying to ensure some minimum standards and for trying to help local authorities through partnerships; on the other hand, we are criticised for not having given more stringent advice to councils on where they should invest their money. As I say, one cannot have it both ways: devolution means just that.

I thought that the hon. Member for East Devon (Mr. Swire) made an excellent speech, and I say that in a non-patronising way. As a London councillor and London MP, I will not have experienced first hand some of the changes that he articulated. I know that he feels passionately about the subject and he made a clear case. Let me inform the House that the hon. Gentleman was correct that we are still waiting for the boundary committee’s final advice to the Secretary of State at the end of 2008. Until we receive that advice, the Government have no role, so I am not going to comment further on the specifics that we heard this afternoon. I assure the House, however, that we will give proper consideration to the boundary committee’s advice and that we will take note of all representations received in the allotted time before we take any decision.

The hon. Gentleman also spoke about the accountability of regional Ministers. He criticised the setting up of regional Select Committees because he saw them as further increasing the size of government, but I am sure he will be aware that Select Committees play a huge role in providing scrutiny of Governments through checks and balances. The hon. Gentleman may not be aware that on 6 November, a debate is scheduled on that very topic and we will see if the recommendations on those Committees are supported.

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Julia Goldsworthy: The Minister is absolutely right to say that Select Committees provide an important balance, but does he not think that if the Government were committed to demonstrating Select Committees’ commitment to the devolution process, their chairmanships would reflect the political party balance of the region rather than which party is in government? It does not look as though we shall have anything other than a Labour chair of the south-west regional Select Committee.

Mr. Khan: I am grateful to the hon. Lady for that helpful intervention. As she knows from her long experience in the House, those are matters for the House and its administration. I am aware from some of the minutes of the Modernisation Committee, which make pretty turgid reading, that there has been a huge amount of discussion about the issue. I gather that the meetings were more fun that the minutes.

The hon. Member for East Devon also raised a matter relating to the Minister for the South West, my hon. Friend the Member for Exeter (Mr. Bradshaw). I will not go into it, for reasons that the hon. Gentleman will understand. The Minister for the South West is a friend, and an honourable friend.

Mr. Swire: The Minister is being very gracious in giving way. Let me clarify for the record that I referred to the hon. Member for Exeter in the context of the south-west, and pointed out that whatever I said about him could apply equally to other regional Ministers.

Mr. Khan: I think the hon. Gentleman said that my hon. Friend was building a fortress around Exeter so that he could not be defeated. I paraphrase his remarks.

My hon. Friend the Member for Bassetlaw, who is also a former councillor, made an excellent speech. He explained why the White Paper and the forthcoming Bill are so crucial, giving examples of the problems that exist in the current system. The hon. Member for Falmouth and Camborne expressed a similar view when she said that the status quo could be improved, and that we should do our best to improve it. My hon. Friend’s analysis of the Icelandic crisis was cool and measured. He rightly said observed that at some stage we must re-evaluate the reasons for the position in which certain councils find themselves, and 22 May is clearly a date that we shall want to revisit.

The hon. Member for Hemel Hempstead (Mike Penning) is a friend, and I always enjoy his contributions. He spends a great deal of time in the Chamber. I recall his raising the issue that he raised today back in the days when I was parliamentary private secretary to the Leader of the House. The Buncefield issue is important to him, and it should be important to the rest of us. As the Minister responsible for fire and rescue, I can assure him that we are considering all the issues relating to Buncefield in the light of the hazards report. I shall write to him, and if he is not satisfied with my response I shall be happy to meet him. I recognise that his passion arises from concerns expressed to him by his constituents, and his own frustration over what he considers to be inaction over the past two or three years.

The hon. Gentleman mentioned empty property relief for business premises. As he will appreciate, on day 10 of my new job I am not entirely on top of the subject.

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Mr. Andrew Robathan (Blaby) (Con): Sort it out!

Mr. Khan: The shadow Deputy Chief Whip is heckling me from a sedentary position. I ask him to give me time. We shall see what we can do.

The hon. Member for Northampton, South (Mr. Binley) made an interesting speech. He spoke of the way in which the south is deprived by the rich, the way in which the relative-needs formula is unfair on his constituents, and the way in which his council is poorly funded. Some of us talk of a victim mentality. That applies not just to certain groups or communities, but to certain Members of Parliament and councils who speak of what they consider to be partial funding. But let me add, in fairness to the hon. Gentleman, that at least he was brave enough to come forward with a manifesto on local government for his party. He wants to abolish the national standards regime, to change the funding regime, and to abolish the Barnett formula. We shall see whether his suggestions are taken up by those on his Front Bench.

The hon. Gentleman’s hon. Friend the. Member for Wycombe (Mr. Goodman) spoke, characteristically, in a partial, unbalanced but witty fashion. I enjoyed his contribution, as I always do. I think that he and I agree on the ends—such as community cohesion—and also on some of the challenges that we face, although I suspect that we disagree to an extent on the means. He was wise to point out that issues of terrorism and extremism are not the purview of a single faith, religion or race, and I am pleased that he gave other similar examples. I shall write to him to answer some his questions, but if he considers a meeting with me to be desirable, I shall be happy to meet him—with or without officials—to discuss the issues that he raised. We need national unity during the times of crisis that he described, as well as at times of economic crisis.

This has been a very important debate, and I congratulate all who were able to take part in it.

It being Seven o’clock, the motion lapsed, without Question put .